Issue link: https://digital.copcomm.com/i/1520149
Fran: And you said it took you 15 years to get that movie made. Barbra: Yeah. Because who wanted to do a movie about, you know, a Jewish girl who wanted to study Talmud, and she had to dress as a man in order to get into school? Fran: You were breaking the ceiling in filmmaking for women by having the tenacity to say, "I can do more than just be in front of the camera." Barbra: Exactly. Fran: So did you realize in the moment that you were doing something that was even bigger than the sum of its parts? Because you were leading women and girls into a future that looked different than the one that you came out of. Barbra: I think it has nothing to do with male or female. If you have a vision, it's a complete vision. That's why I had to do all those jobs. I had a responsibility; I had that on my shoulders. Fran: To women and girls, or just to the movie? Barbra: No, to women and girls and the movie. It's all one thing. In other words, I have a vision, and people are frightened that I can't control financial things. I enjoyed that position: having to say, "Okay, if we shoot today and it's gray out, but I want lights on the water, I want the sun to be shining, to give us a hopeful feeling when Yentl is crossing that little river to go to her school," I have to weigh that. I'm weighing; tell me the cost. I'm capable of, you know, handling finances. What will it cost if I put it off till tomorrow and wait for the sun? In other words, I loved balancing the reality of the budget to the aesthetic. That's just a grown-up [thing]. I've noticed — because [I] watch a lot of films, and there are so many more women directing now. It's like, it used to be such a shock, "directed by a woman," but in the last few years, many women have been directing movies. Fran: And I think television opened that up first. There are a lot of women directors that are in television, both in one-hour and multi-cam, which is what I did, and I directed some of those. Barbra: You know, I made a documentary about the first women in film. When I was making Yentl, I did research about these women. And even [though] D.W. Griffith is called the father of film, these women were making films in 1916, before he made his great film. Fran: That's why they call it his-story, not her-story. Barbra: That's right; very good point. Fran: So you've done TV, you've done Broadway and, of course, you've done film and you've done them all well. But is there something that you like the best? Barbra: Well, I love film, but when I was in Funny Girl [onstage] — oh, my god! I love the experimental part of the job, meaning — Fran: "Putting it together," like Sondheim said. Barbra: Yes, putting it together. We had 41 different last scenes for Funny Girl. Opening night was the 42nd — good number too, by the way — that we'd closed the show with that. You know, the 42nd version. I loved the different versions. I loved experimenting! Fran: Of course, it speaks volumes for you as a director. … So you started in comedy and then you transitioned into drama. They say that comic actors make the best dramatic actors. What do you have to say to all that? Barbra: Life is both. Life is funny at times and life is sad at times, and the most interesting comedies have something serious at the core. Tragedy sometimes starts with a clown, right? Fran: Needless to say, especially in our industry, there are a lot of people that carry the burden of insecurities. How do you leverage your own insecurities as a help rather than a hindrance? Barbra: I would be suspicious of any actor who wasn't, somewhere, insecure. It's part of the game, because the actor has to expose his inner self, his soul, his secrets. And that makes him very vulnerable, which is great, allowing that. Now, I mean, I can be both things: I can be very confident — well, no, I've never gone on stage [confidently]. When a new concert comes up, I always think, "Well, they won't come," or "They'll walk out." I have that [insecurity], but I also know that there is strength and confidence in even being insecure. And having the confidence to be insecure as well. Fran: Right. Have the confidence to be vulnerable and own it. It's trying to mask it or be afraid of it happening that's the torture. Barbra: I mean, I'm confident in my singing a song about vulnerability, but I have to be open to that part of me that is singing … Nobody's just insecure or nobody's that confident. Except assholes. … Confidence, such total confidence, is kind of a turnoff. Do you know what I mean? 70 SAG-AFTRA | Spring 2024 | sagaftra.org You know what I would suggest to anybody: Examine your dreams. [They are] the key to your unconscious before you are ready for it to be conscious … Continues